Sadly, NYT gave Vance the win DESPITE his constant lying. A performative liar gets the win. That certainly says it all.
Walz is my Governor and I could see how furious he was feeling about Vance’s lies. Anger really affects cognition in everyone and he didn’t have his usual snappy comebacks. Nevertheless, he is not a liar (the ridiculous question about Tiananmen Square notwithstanding).
He made a few really good rejoinders but I don’t think he changed the hearts and minds. But I don’t think Vance gained any converts either.
Robert, it’s a travesty from my point of view. We’re supposed to be a well educated Democracy with established, educated, accomplished individuals running for the highest office in our land and in the free world. With these debates, we should be getting a deep dive into each candidate’s personality, philosophy, experiences, thoughts on how to make our nation and union even better than it is. We should be getting highly adept, skilled journalists asking very pertinent questions to each candidate to answer in a timely fashion. We should be getting journalists who inform the public when a candidate is either misinformed, wrong, or outright lying. What we get nowadays is a single candidate experienced, articulate, accomplished, and interested in helping our nation be better and another candidate who hates our Democracy lying with reckless abandon for effect. All the while a lazy, disinterested pair of journalists ignore the time honored tradition of helping we Americans uncover the next great President we can all be proud of. I’m embarrassed, disgusted and so angry at some of our fellow citizens and the corporate media journalists that are so engaged in advancing a fascist movement here in our democracy all because it brings in more fucking money. God help us. There’s nobody else out there who’s got our back.
So many lies. And no fact checking (save one feeble attempt) from CBS. Our media is totally broken; CBS pretty clearly sold its soul (no fact check) to get Vance to do the debate. And Vance spewed lies nonstop. This is what we get when we have a commercial media that is much more interested in profit than anything else.
It dumpy wins, his team will try to keep him in office so that THEY can call the shots. That will make it very easy for the writers of 2025 to accomplish their goals. If dumpy is gone and JD is VP, he may have too many opinions of his own and be ready for a fight.
I thought Vance came across as superficial…going around in incomprehensible circles to avoid answering questions. When he did make comments he lied, blaming Kamala Harris for everything wrong with the world…
His persona was smoother than Trump’s but no less frightening…
Tim does great but MAGA people don't watch. Neverthe less, he should have pointed out near perfect 3-4% unimployment, taking border as a long term project where US/Mexico build elevated
super train as border fence, creation of entirely new high tech city open to all with massive job
creation, canal for water, university and entertainment center. Short teerm never does enough.
Walz disappointed me. I wanted him to be clearer. I think he did better answering questions and offering real plans. Vance was very smooth. He said very little of substance and created a fantasy world of the past Trump administration. His refusing to say that Biden won the election should be enough to keep him out of office..
JD proved (to his bossman) a Smooooth Operator. And just like his bossman, just as full of deviation and tripe. TWalz proved to be full of information and evidence of a life of contribution and demonstrated to be significantly well oriented in government policy. His well timed dagger asking
why JD, rather than M Pence, was now standing for vp, came at a time everyone will remember.
I don't think there was a winner here. Walz was clearly nervous _I don't blame him_ but warmed up as the later in the debate and got his important points across. Vance was slick, a liar, continued to defend his and Trump's dangerous rhetoric about abortions and immigrants, and did not answer crucial questions.
The debate was between the city slicker cousin who for ages has ignored his down home family and the down home relative who has provided support to all family members in need. The city slicker clearly sees himself as better than his family. The home relative sees himself caring for all family members.
I thought Vance did his job which was to improve his image. I was concerned about Walz for about the first 40 minutes, he looked like a deer in headlights and flustered. The moderators did an excellent job in asking detailed questions and attempting to gain a response to the question from candidates. I disappointingly can admit I found the debate to be a toss up. Even if I understand the vast number of lies Vance spoke, I do not believe the low information voter would know. Final analysis-debate performance has nothing to do with substance (even if voters say they want answers) in the end it is perception over substance. The focus group response from WaPo is very disconcerting. Had more Tramp voters after debate than Harris. Unbelievable!!!
Maybe Tim will be remembered for catching Vance on The Big Lie.
Maybe JD will be remembered for telling the moderator: “I thought we agreed on no fact checking.” Today and tomorrow polls and the big board will calculate changes due to this debate, percentage moves in favorability ratings. Whether JD was coached to audition. Whether Tim was coached to do no harm.
I would have like our guy to have been stronger/meaner/louder. But, he was himself, unlike Vance who turned up as somebody else last night.
Historically, VP debates come and go, with no lasting influence. Good.
Vance is a wolf in sheep’s clothing….
Sadly, NYT gave Vance the win DESPITE his constant lying. A performative liar gets the win. That certainly says it all.
Walz is my Governor and I could see how furious he was feeling about Vance’s lies. Anger really affects cognition in everyone and he didn’t have his usual snappy comebacks. Nevertheless, he is not a liar (the ridiculous question about Tiananmen Square notwithstanding).
He made a few really good rejoinders but I don’t think he changed the hearts and minds. But I don’t think Vance gained any converts either.
Robert, it’s a travesty from my point of view. We’re supposed to be a well educated Democracy with established, educated, accomplished individuals running for the highest office in our land and in the free world. With these debates, we should be getting a deep dive into each candidate’s personality, philosophy, experiences, thoughts on how to make our nation and union even better than it is. We should be getting highly adept, skilled journalists asking very pertinent questions to each candidate to answer in a timely fashion. We should be getting journalists who inform the public when a candidate is either misinformed, wrong, or outright lying. What we get nowadays is a single candidate experienced, articulate, accomplished, and interested in helping our nation be better and another candidate who hates our Democracy lying with reckless abandon for effect. All the while a lazy, disinterested pair of journalists ignore the time honored tradition of helping we Americans uncover the next great President we can all be proud of. I’m embarrassed, disgusted and so angry at some of our fellow citizens and the corporate media journalists that are so engaged in advancing a fascist movement here in our democracy all because it brings in more fucking money. God help us. There’s nobody else out there who’s got our back.
So many lies. And no fact checking (save one feeble attempt) from CBS. Our media is totally broken; CBS pretty clearly sold its soul (no fact check) to get Vance to do the debate. And Vance spewed lies nonstop. This is what we get when we have a commercial media that is much more interested in profit than anything else.
It dumpy wins, his team will try to keep him in office so that THEY can call the shots. That will make it very easy for the writers of 2025 to accomplish their goals. If dumpy is gone and JD is VP, he may have too many opinions of his own and be ready for a fight.
I thought Vance came across as superficial…going around in incomprehensible circles to avoid answering questions. When he did make comments he lied, blaming Kamala Harris for everything wrong with the world…
His persona was smoother than Trump’s but no less frightening…
walz won on substance ? ok but voters who dont know facts would think Vance was smooth
Tim does great but MAGA people don't watch. Neverthe less, he should have pointed out near perfect 3-4% unimployment, taking border as a long term project where US/Mexico build elevated
super train as border fence, creation of entirely new high tech city open to all with massive job
creation, canal for water, university and entertainment center. Short teerm never does enough.
Walz disappointed me. I wanted him to be clearer. I think he did better answering questions and offering real plans. Vance was very smooth. He said very little of substance and created a fantasy world of the past Trump administration. His refusing to say that Biden won the election should be enough to keep him out of office..
I like that they were both civil; however, only one of them was trustworthy in my opinion.
JD proved (to his bossman) a Smooooth Operator. And just like his bossman, just as full of deviation and tripe. TWalz proved to be full of information and evidence of a life of contribution and demonstrated to be significantly well oriented in government policy. His well timed dagger asking
why JD, rather than M Pence, was now standing for vp, came at a time everyone will remember.
"A President's words matter" Tim Walz 10-1-2024
I don't think there was a winner here. Walz was clearly nervous _I don't blame him_ but warmed up as the later in the debate and got his important points across. Vance was slick, a liar, continued to defend his and Trump's dangerous rhetoric about abortions and immigrants, and did not answer crucial questions.
The debate was between the city slicker cousin who for ages has ignored his down home family and the down home relative who has provided support to all family members in need. The city slicker clearly sees himself as better than his family. The home relative sees himself caring for all family members.
I thought Vance did his job which was to improve his image. I was concerned about Walz for about the first 40 minutes, he looked like a deer in headlights and flustered. The moderators did an excellent job in asking detailed questions and attempting to gain a response to the question from candidates. I disappointingly can admit I found the debate to be a toss up. Even if I understand the vast number of lies Vance spoke, I do not believe the low information voter would know. Final analysis-debate performance has nothing to do with substance (even if voters say they want answers) in the end it is perception over substance. The focus group response from WaPo is very disconcerting. Had more Tramp voters after debate than Harris. Unbelievable!!!
Maybe Tim will be remembered for catching Vance on The Big Lie.
Maybe JD will be remembered for telling the moderator: “I thought we agreed on no fact checking.” Today and tomorrow polls and the big board will calculate changes due to this debate, percentage moves in favorability ratings. Whether JD was coached to audition. Whether Tim was coached to do no harm.
I would have like our guy to have been stronger/meaner/louder. But, he was himself, unlike Vance who turned up as somebody else last night.
Historically, VP debates come and go, with no lasting influence. Good.